My 4th Edition Champions: BASH style

Sijo · Post by **Sijo** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 9:08 am

I believe a Multipower can have *any* number of powers *for free* listed under it, as long as they cost less than the base power. However I don't think you can include a multipower inside another, though you would have to ask BASHMAN about it.

BTW, remember that what is considered a Power in another game isn't necessary one in BASH. It could be a Power Stunt, an Advantage, or Special Equipment. For help with this, check my Conversion Guide elsewhere in this Forum.

DevastatingWeakness · Post by **DevastatingWeakness** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 2:11 pm

I don't think you can add as many powers as you like to a Multi-power for free. You pick a base power, then each power that you add under the base power requires adding the Multi-power enhancement to the base power, which increases in cost by 1pt (if the added power comes from the same category as the base power) or 2pts (if the added power comes from a different category).

The added powers must have a cost equal to or less than the base power (not counting the cost of the Multi-power enhancements).

So that gives you a list of extra powers under the base power, for which you only paid one or two points each. The drawback is that you can only have one of the powers in the Multi-power active at a time.

That's the way I implemented Multi-powers in www.BASHCreator.net, and BASHMAN has reviewed that.

MrJupiter · Post by **MrJupiter** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 8:25 pm

I'd also like to add that powers from the same Power Suite as the original (see the various Awesome Powers books), can be added to a multi-power for 1 point as well, even if they come from a different BASH power category.

Sijo · Post by **Sijo** » Tue Nov 01, 2016 8:09 am

OK, I re-read the Multi-Power rules and I understand it better now. I was confused by some early discussions on the subject on the Forum. I still feel this "enhancement" isn't terribly useful except for buying powers cheaply, and for powers worth only 1 point (2 in some cases), it's no good at all.

Also, I guess the rules don't specifically forbid the powers in the MP from having their own multipowers, but there seems to be no advantage to that (you're still limited to using one power from the whole construct at a time).

DevastatingWeakness · Post by **DevastatingWeakness** » Tue Nov 01, 2016 8:56 am

The advantages of a Multi-power are that it gives the character a wider range of powers, and you get those powers at a pretty big point discount (unless they are only 1 or 2 points). So you can buy a bunch of 9 point powers for 1 point each (if they all come from the same category).

The downside is that you can't use any of those powers at the same time. If you have one of the powers on, and then you use one of the other powers, the first power immediately turns off. This can lead to interesting decisions and interesting character designs. Say you have a 'Kinetic Manipulation' multi-power that has Fly 5, Armor 3 and Special Attack (Ranged) 5. If you're flying, you can't effectively attack or defend yourself - so you have to time your movement carefully. If you're on the ground, you can defend yourself with Armor, but the moment you use Special Attack, your Armor turns off, and you won't be able to re-activate it until your next panel.

I've heard the word 'game' defined as 'a series of interesting decisions'. Multi-powers definitely create interesting decisions... more options, but with difficult trade-offs.

Sijo · Post by **Sijo** » Tue Nov 01, 2016 9:54 pm

Yeah I get the point-saving part. But within the game, it definitely comes across more as a Limitation than an Enhancement.

I think Multi-Powers are most useful with powers that are redundant; for example, since your Panel ends the moment you use an attack, you could place several Combat Powers on a MP and switch to whichever is most useful in a given situation; supports powers like Movement however should be bought separately.

Btw would it be possible to keep the Generator from repeating the term "Multi-Power" over and over when used? Once along the base Power is enough.

DevastatingWeakness · Post by **DevastatingWeakness** » Wed Nov 02, 2016 8:50 am

I think I'll have to leave the repeating 'Multi-power' enhancement title in. Without it, it's not clear why there's power is inside the base power. There's also more than one way that a power can be inside another power - Multi-power, Multi-power (Same Suite), Linked, and there's some other ways from the Awesome Powers line (like After Effect and the Doubles enhancement).

MrJupiter · Post by **MrJupiter** » Wed Nov 02, 2016 7:17 pm

Sijo wrote:OK, I re-read the Multi-Power rules and I understand it better now. I was confused by some early discussions on the subject on the Forum. I still feel this "enhancement" isn't terribly useful except for buying powers cheaply, and for powers worth only 1 point (2 in some cases), it's no good at all.

Also, I guess the rules don't specifically forbid the powers in the MP from having their own multipowers, but there seems to be no advantage to that (you're still limited to using one power from the whole construct at a time).

I'm a guy who loves to add more than one limitation to a power just to ensure that it creates a great effect, so adding a 1-2 point power to a Multi-power list is a no-brainer to me, IF it fits the concept I have for the hero or villain. I don't like to add in powers to a Multi-power framework just to get more super-powered bang for the buck.

I love the structure of the Multi-power enhancement (especially when building 20-point heroes on the Mystery Men scale. The aspect of "tough decisions" inherent in the Multi-power structure is a cool balance for getting 12 Character Points worth of powers for half the cost.

Also, FWIW, I like that the program identifies each Multi-power because it provides me a quick visual cue that, "Oh yeah, this is still part of that top power's array." (but that's just a weakness of my easily distracted, and forgetful, mind...)

MrJupiter · Post by **MrJupiter** » Wed Nov 02, 2016 7:25 pm

As for the concept of a power having sub-powers, that are themselves in a Multi-power, is a new concept to me. While the rules, as Sijo states do not forbid this option, I would think that the grand total of all of this subordinate Multi-power structure must still come out to less-than, or equal-to, the main power (or act as the new base power when figuring out the total points-cost of the entire Multi-power arrangement).

DevastatingWeakness · Post by **DevastatingWeakness** » Wed Nov 02, 2016 8:57 pm

Having a Multi-power in a Multi-power (in a Multi-power...etc.) is not something I've ever seen in print anywhere, or on this message board. I only realized that it was technically possible when I was coding up the BASHCreator site.

That said... you really shouldn't let anyone nest Multi-powers. It allows the following grossly abusive trick:

http://www.bashcreator.net/#/load/2mrse

Multi-Power Abuse Man
12 points (6 Stats, 6 Powers )
Description...

Brawn 1 Agility 1 Mind 1
x1 Defence, x1 Mental Defence, x1 Soak

Powers

* Multi-power: (6pts)
* Super Running 5 (Run 8 squares per panel. (Top speed is 80mph.))
- * Enhancement: Multi-power (Pick a power worth up to 5 pts. Powers can not be used together.)
  - * Multi-power: (6pts)
    * Flight 5 (Fly 25 squares per panel.)
    - * Enhancement: Multi-power (Pick a power worth up to 5 pts. Powers can not be used together.)
      - * Multi-power: (6pts)
        * Teleportation 5 (Teleport 200 squares as a move; teleport to the moon with concentration (hundreds of thousands of miles).)
        
        * Enhancement: Multi-power (Pick a power worth up to 5 pts. Powers can not be used together.)
        
        * Multi-power: (6pts)
        * Super Speed 5 (Extra two panels (or +2 Agility) per page. +2 Priority. Tiring.)
        
        * Enhancement: Multi-power (Pick a power worth up to 5 pts. Powers can not be used together.)
        
        * Multi-power: (6pts)
        * Teleportation (Gateway) 5 (Open gateway to 100 squares as a move; open gateway to anywhere on Earth with concentration (tens of thousands of miles).)
        
        * Enhancement: Multi-power (Pick a power worth up to 5 pts. Powers can not be used together.)
        [list]
        * Super Swimming (Burrowing) 5 (Burrow 6 squares per panel.) (5pts)

[/list]

Yep, for just one extra point, you can buy all of the powers in one power category at Level 5. Just Say No.

Post by **BASHMAN** » Thu Nov 03, 2016 1:11 am

Actually that would cost 5 points plus 1 per multi-power (from the same category). So that would actually be more than 6 points.

DevastatingWeakness · Post by **DevastatingWeakness** » Thu Nov 03, 2016 8:34 am

If I'd built Abuse Man the usual way (with each power added to to the base power, instead of each power being added as a Multi-power on the Multi-power before it) it'd cost 10 points (see below).

I think the 'nested multi-power' trick is a) a genuine, technically-legal exploit of the system, and b) should be immediately banned and punished by all right-thinking game masters.

I should probably modify BASHCreator so that you can only add the Multi-power enhancement to a power that is not in a multi-power itself.

http://www.bashcreator.net/#/load/2smfq

Multi-power Non-Abuse Man
16 points (6 Stats, 10 Powers )
Description...

Brawn 1 Agility 1 Mind 1
x1 Defence, x1 Mental Defence, x1 Soak

Powers

* Multi-power: (10pts)
* Super Running 5 (Run 8 squares per panel. (Top speed is 80mph.))
- * Enhancement: Multi-power (Pick a power worth up to 5 pts. Powers can not be used together.)
  - * Flight 5 (Fly 25 squares per panel.) (5pts)
  * Enhancement: Multi-power (Pick a power worth up to 5 pts. Powers can not be used together.)
  - * Teleportation 5 (Teleport 200 squares as a move; teleport to the moon with concentration (hundreds of thousands of miles).) (5pts)
  * Enhancement: Multi-power (Pick a power worth up to 5 pts. Powers can not be used together.)
  - * Super Speed 5 (Extra two panels (or +2 Agility) per page. +2 Priority. Tiring.) (5pts)
  * Enhancement: Multi-power (Pick a power worth up to 5 pts. Powers can not be used together.)
  - * Teleportation (Gateway) 5 (Open gateway to 100 squares as a move; open gateway to anywhere on Earth with concentration (tens of thousands of miles).) (5pts)
  * Enhancement: Multi-power (Pick a power worth up to 5 pts. Powers can not be used together.)
  - * Super Swimming (Burrowing) 5 (Burrow 6 squares per panel.) (5pts)

Solarblast · Post by **Solarblast** » Thu Nov 03, 2016 9:00 pm

Looks like I started something here

Solarblast · Post by **Solarblast** » Sat Nov 05, 2016 9:12 am

Here is Starburst

Starburst
23 points (8 Stats, 19 Powers , -4 Weaknesses)
Description...

Brawn 1 Agility 2 Mind 1
x2 Defence, x3 Mental Defence, x3 Soak

Powers

* Starlight Energy : Special Attack (Ranged) 5 (Agility +1DM to Hit and Mind +4DM to Damage; total x3 to hit, x7 damage.) (9pts)
- * Enhancement: Range (Mid) Range of 5x power's damage multiplier, or 5x power level (25 sq.).
  * Enhancement: Linked Linked to one power worth up to 7 pts. Both used simultaneously. Both must have same range/area.
  - * Starburst : Daze 2 (Attack Mind x3 vs Mind to cause target to lose next panel, until target makes 20 Mind Check (one try per panel). Dazed target cannot dodge (but being hit un-dazes them).) (4pts)
    - * Enhancement: Range (Mid) Range of 5x power's damage multiplier, or 5x power level (10 sq.).
* Only for Special Attack Starlight power : Boost (Mind) 2 (Increase Mind by 2 in specific conditions or circumstance.) (2pts)
* Infrared Vision : Super Senses 1 (Pick 1 extra senses.) (1pts)
* Sight : Keen Senses 1 (+3 to Mind for one sense.) (1pts)
* Flight 4 (Fly 20 squares per panel.) (4pts)
* Personal Force Field : Armor 2 (+2 to Brawn to Soak damage.) (2pts)

Weaknesses
Damaging Weakness: Double damage from [source]. Edged attacks (-2pts)
Vulnerability: Take damage (like fire) from [source]. Darkness Attacks (-2pts)
Skills
Mental Skills: Science/Physics x3
Physical Skills:
Advantages & Disadvantages
Celebrity: Well-known and popular.
Arch-Enemy: You have an enemy worth similar character points. Pulsar
Other
Priority: x2, Defence: x2, Mental Defence: x3, Soak: x3, Hits: 100

Lift: 50 lbs, Run: 6 squares, Jump: 1 squares, Climb: 1 squares, Fly: 20 squares, Swim: 1 squares

Solarblast · Post by **Solarblast** » Sat Nov 05, 2016 2:17 pm

Here is Pulsar the first supervillain. Been around from the beginning too.

Pulsar
22 points (10 Stats, 14 Powers , -2 Weaknesses)
Description...Frank Costen found his life going nowhere. He was too poor to get himself drunk, and, being a high school dropout dishonorably discharged from the Army, couldn’t find any gainful employment even when he tried. Getting a tip that VIPER was recruiting, he jumped at the chance. Sure there’d be officers to deal with once again, but with his military experience, he’d be sure to get in. Besides, he was desperate. The tip turned out to be legit, and soon Frank was being given a physical. When the results came in, he recieved an offer. They were looking for some “special recruits” to be come part of an elite fighting unit. Would he be interested? Let’s see,… recognized his talents, better pay…. Oh * yes! It looked like his luck was changing, and things were finally going to be turning around… The “evaluation test” for this “elite force” turned out to nothing more than experiments in human mutation. As the electronic hum of the machinery he was strapped to rose in pitch, Frank felt intense pain sear through every cell of his body. It then got worse, and even worse still. In so much agony, Frank barely noticed when the machinery overloaded and exploded around him. He was uncertain how much time had passed, all that he knew was that the pain had ended. Apart from being buried in rubble, he felt better than ever had in his entire life. In fact, he felt as if he was bursting with energy! With a mere gesture, he blasted the rubble off his body and stood, seething with intense power and anger. Someone would pay for the pain they inflicted upon him. Surrounded by VIPER agents, he was ordered to stand down. Not a single agent nor scientist was left alive as he blasted the remains of that small VIPER outpost into crumbling pieces. The power was now his with which to do whatever he pleased. Since then, Frank, using the name Pulsar, has been a common sight on the supervillain scene. Sometimes involved with a scheme of his own, sometimes with other criminals, he has fought most of the major (and minor, for that matter) superheroes in America. He’s done precious little winning though. For some reason, things just don’t seem to go his way. But this next job, it’s perfect you see, nothing can posibly go wrong…

Mental Malfunction: Pulsar is, at heart, a lazy underachiever. He thinks of himself as the stuff master villains are made of, and one of the most powerful men in the world. The truth is, he doesn’t work hard at anything, and expects to be handed fame, fortune, and women on a silver platter. He has an excuse for everything that goes wrong, explaining away all his failures as “bad luck.” The fact that he’s sometimes correct about this just reinforces this behaviour. Despite numerous failures and imprisonments, Pulsar still displays a remarkable sense of self-confidence. He’s a bit of a show-off and is certain that he has the power to defeat anyone. He loves to hear flattering comments and extravagant praise, and will be putty in the hands of an attractive woman willing to deliver such to him. Despite a noted belligerence about following orders (which got him dishonorably discharged from the Army), it doesn’t take much for a charismatic person to manipulate Pulsar into doing their bidding.

Brawn 2 Agility 2 Mind 1
x2 Defence, x1 Mental Defence, x3 Soak

Powers

* Heightened (Agility) 1 (+3 Result bonus to Agility rolls. Triple lifting benchmarks.) (1pts)
* Heightened (Brawn) 1 (+3 Result bonus to Brawn rolls. x3 Lift.) (1pts)
* Multi-power: (7pts)
* Special Attack (Ranged) 4 (Agility +0DM to Hit and Mind +4DM to Damage; total x2+3 to hit, x7 damage.)
- * Tagged with [Special Attack]
 * Enhancement: Range (Mid) Range of 5x power's damage multiplier, or 5x power level (20 sq.).
 * Enhancement: Multi-power (Same Power Suite) Pick a power worth up to 6 pts. Powers can not be used together.
 - * Weaken (Agility attack, weakens Brawn) 3 (Roll your Agility x2+3 vs target's Agility. If hit, roll contest of 4DM vs target's highest Stat. If win, target's Brawn has -3 Dice Penalty for the scene, which reduces damage and Soak rolls.) (5pts)
 - * Enhancement: Range (Mid) Range of 5x power's damage multiplier, or 5x power level (15 sq.).
* Personal Force Field : Armor 1 (+1 to Brawn to Soak damage.) (1pts)
* To Special Attack : Boost (Mind) 2 (Increase Mind by 2 in specific conditions or circumstance.) (2pts)
- * Applies to powers tagged with [Special Attack]
* Military training : Martial Arts Mastery (Fast, Defensive, Grappling Styles) 2 (Fast: Priority is Agility + 1.Defensive: +2 Agility to defend against hand-to-hand attacks (max 5).Grappling: Get reversal of 10+, even on foe's panel. +1 multiplier on wrestling rolls.) (2pts)

Weaknesses
Damaging Weakness: Double damage from [source]. Cutting weapons (-2pts)
Skills
Mental Skills: Military/Demolitions x1
Physical Skills: Drive/Control x2, Stealth/Evade Security Cameras & Alarms x2
Advantages & Disadvantages
Instant Change: You can instantly change from normal identity to super identity.
Arch-Enemy: You have an enemy worth similar character points. Starburst
Other
Priority: x3+3, Defence: x2+3, Mental Defence: x1, Soak: x3+3, Hits: 100

Lift: 1200 lbs, Run: 6 squares, Jump: 4 squares, Climb: 2 squares, Swim: 2 squares