Team Up Moves

[AngryGhost]

does anyone know if a site on this interweb thingy where one might find a list of double up/team moves for superheroes?

if not, should we come up with our own list? - might be good for writing some rules.

(all I can find is Wrestling moves and Woverine being thrown by Colossus)

[doktorelektron]

Hi,

Wikipedia has a list of wrestling double-team moves here.

My personal favourite is the Doomsday Device

[AngryGhost]

yeah thanks, have seen that

I'm thinking more of spider-man swinging around a sword wielding hero
or
Pyro setting light to cars that Magneto is flinging

in an attempt to think of some more involved rules for them (not necessarily individually though)

[BASHMAN]

From my experience, it's probably best to NOT have a pre-defined list. These things are at their best when the players cooperate and think of something right there at the table. Spontaneity is part of the fun, in my opinion.

That way you get something original each time. Some very memorable ones I've seen include:

Water controller creating a GIANT sphere of water while shapeshifter turns into a blue whale. The "Whale in a Hamster Ball" then proceeds to swim around the battlefield, swallowing all the enemy robots. Then, the whale blasts them out of his blow-hole. The players sing "It's raining men! Hallelujah it's raining men! Robot Men!"

If you want some inspiration a good thing to check out is Marvel Ultimate Alliance 2 videogame, as they have lots of team up attacks (one for every possible team-up). So in that game you can see the Hulk in a force field hamster ball smashing his way around the enemies, or Thor using Lightning to electrify Wolverine's claws, etc.

[kevperrine]

From my experience, it's probably best to NOT have a pre-defined list. These things are at their best when the players cooperate and think of something right there at the table. Spontaneity is part of the fun, in my opinion.

In theory I 100% agree with this point.
In practice, in my experience, it's not that easy - and I think it would be handy to have a list covering the most common (and a few interesting odd unique ideas). Two reasons:

#1. some players just aren't that creative... combined with those players (and the creative ones) simply not thinking about doing a team-up combo... in my experience, players (especially players coming from fantasy and other RPGs) just don't *think* in terms of working that closely as a team. Many players will consider "flanking" moves (that go with their "sneak attacks") or buffing others with spells/powers, but most games either don't allow or deter the idea of doing "complicated" maneuver with rules that make it cumbersome and/or more or more difficult rule checks - WITHOUT providing a value/benefit worth the effort or risk of failure. In essence, in most RPGs it's just better to say "I punch him." and move on.

#2. connected to the above.... if a more complicated idea for a maneuver isn't something that is intuitive to determine what rule to use, many times it will discourage a Narrator or player from wanting to deal with the hassle to look it up and/or figure it out. So... my thought here is, if you have several of the more common examples with "elegant" rule usage to complete the maneuver OR if you have the benefit of the action be "worth" the extra effort (to look up the rule) and/or be worth the higher difficulty class to succeed (or multiple successes) ... THEN it's worth it.

Having a solid little list would at least help players with the common comic book moves, and potentially aid in the creativity of building NEW moves.

If you want some inspiration a good thing to check out is Marvel Ultimate Alliance 2 videogame, as they have lots of team up attacks (one for every possible team-up).

Wow! That's a great suggestion! (I wish I liked to play video games, ugh)

AngryGhost... I have a couple thoughts of places to research:
- look at other super hero games as well as the more pulpy RPGs
- I think there was an older White Wolf supplement called "COMBAT" or something like that, I think it had a bunch of combo moves as well as individual moves.
- Savage Worlds or Feng Shui might be a good source to look at for these.


I'll take some time and look through those if I can find them, for you...
Good idea though!

-kev-

[AngryGhost]

part of it stems from over reading - I want to help players out with suggestions but I've got a dozen rule sets in my head. - I actually struggled with running Feng Shui last week, which should have been easy as pie.

Whilst I'm not necessarily looking to make major rules up for it, bashmans Whale in a hamster ball example did more to get the creative mind ticking then I've had in a while.

Will check out Marvel UA - but I'm thinking of 5-6 examples (non wrestling) from the comics for some inspiration.

If I were to rule on them, the exact rules probably wouldn't differentiate too much say between colossus throwing wolverine and spidey swinging an ally - esp if it were just mooks going down (end result is what matters most).

I think most combo moves could probably run off 4-5 different "types" of "special combat attack".

but meh, the possibilities are probably endless so I'll just go with BASHMAN.

[BASHMAN]

Kevin, in boss fights I always *remind* the players about team-up attacks; usually after the boss has gotten a few good licks in.

Here is a quick list of 5-6

Brick/Controller + Blaster: Brick or Controller throws something, and blaster shoots it, shattering it into a bunch of shrapnel

Brick + Brawler/Weapon Master: Brick chucks the other person, ala Fastball Special

Controller + Brick/Speedster: The Hamsterball of DOOM! Controller makes a forcefield, or maybe just a large mass of X (water in my prior example, depending on what the controller controls), and puts the Brick/Speedster inside it. They are then able to move this ball around at great speed, bowling for mooks.

Stretcher + Brick: The Slingshot trick, sort of a reverse Fastball Special

Blaster + Speedster: Strafe Run. The Speedster picks up the blaster, and runs him around, strafing the enemies all over the place.

Speedster + Controller: Cyclone of Doom: Speedster starts running in circles, creating a vortex that flings out anything that funnels into it at high velocity. Then Controller starts funneling X into it. They've just made an X cannon. You can imagine the destructive power of a giant stone cannon!

[capmarvel]

Haven't found a good super hero list, but I did find this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Profession ... _maneuvers

[MrJupiter]

Kevin, in boss fights I always *remind* the players about team-up attacks; usually after the boss has gotten a few good licks in.

Here is a quick list of 5-6

Brick/Controller + Blaster: Brick or Controller throws something, and blaster shoots it, shattering it into a bunch of shrapnel

Brick + Brawler/Weapon Master: Brick chucks the other person, ala Fastball Special

Controller + Brick/Speedster: The Hamsterball of DOOM! Controller makes a forcefield, or maybe just a large mass of X (water in my prior example, depending on what the controller controls), and puts the Brick/Speedster inside it. They are then able to move this ball around at great speed, bowling for mooks.

Stretcher + Brick: The Slingshot trick, sort of a reverse Fastball Special

Blaster + Speedster: Strafe Run. The Speedster picks up the blaster, and runs him around, strafing the enemies all over the place.

Speedster + Controller: Cyclone of Doom: Speedster starts running in circles, creating a vortex that flings out anything that funnels into it at high velocity. Then Controller starts funneling X into it. They've just made an X cannon. You can imagine the destructive power of a giant stone cannon!

These are awesome! This is like a whole new level of BASH awesomeness. Beyond the basic Colossus + Wolverine Fastball Special, I never really thought about Teamwork actions because, once performed, the Hero die benefit can no longer apply.

I think it would be cool if the rules could give a continuing benefit for heroes that develop signature moves. Wolverine and Colossus use the Fastball Special many times.

Here’s an idea:
What if heroes could purchase a Signature Move for 2 XP each (for the same move)? They’ve performed it once to great affect and have decided to practice the move during their training sessions. Now, by each player spending a hero point, they can execute their signature move in the field and each roll receives a +2 Result bonus to their rolls.

In summary: Each hero spends 2XP to develop a shared Signature Move. Both heroes spend a Hero point and can perform this special team-up action - gaining a +2 Result bonus on each roll. Though they no longer qualify for a Hero Die, but can pull off that cool maneuver.

[kroh]

That sounds like a great house rule.

[BASHMAN]

Mr. J- don't forget that there is already a bonus for using Team Up actions even without the free Hero Die. You get to use the best stat with the best power for both characters.

So Brick with 5 Brawn chucks Ninja with 5 Agility and a Special Attack that does +5DM.

They get to roll x5 to hit (ninja agility), and x10 damage (Brick's Brawn + Special Attack).

The Bonus die is just extra. This also only applies to the first time that team up is done that session. The players could do that maneuver again some other session and get the bonus die: the first time they do it that session. But if they keep doing it, they only get the "best of both worlds" effect, which is still significant in and of itself.

[MrJupiter]

Oh, okay. I get it now. Thanks for fixing me straight on that one BASHMAN.

[kroh]

Nothing like mechanics that constantly allow a giant metal juggernaut to throw a metal laced angry midget like a lawn dart...

Thanks for the clarification BASHMAN.

Regards,
Walt

[kevperrine]

This also only applies to the first time that team up is done that session. The players could do that maneuver again some other session and get the bonus die: the first time they do it that session. But if they keep doing it, they only get the "best of both worlds" effect, which is still significant in and of itself.

Question.
BASHMAN, you note that this applies the FIRST time. Is there a rule in the system (that I've not read) that tells the players or Narrator this?

Where does it talk about "best of both worlds" or getting a bonus die or only using the full effect of the team-up once?

or is this a Narrator suggested house rule?
thanks
-kev-

[AngryGhost]

kev, pretty sure the main gist is covered pages 22/3 unless I'm misreading your question.