Cortex for Marvel? (or Why BASH Rocks!)

[Jukeboxer]

I don't always read comics, but when I do, I prefer Marvel.

Well, that used to be true. These days, I just pick-out an odd book here and there; but nonetheless, when I heard that there was going to be a new Marvel RPG coming, I was very interested.

So have you guys been following the development of the Cortex Marvel game?

The more I learn, the less interested I become. It appears to be closely related to their Smallville game. Die-types are assigned to represent various abilities, aspects, and story-elements. So characters will roll a pool of dice and keep two or three for their score on a given task. Bleh... I'm struggling to see how awesome superheroic combat scenes will unfold when you are looking at a pool of dice trying to justify whether to add your "buddy die" or "enhanced strength die" to the mix. Heck, it sounds like characters will all be rolling similar dice pools and only the reason behind what a given die stands for will change from character to character or situation to situation.

I guess I'm a grognard after all. The current trend of story RPGs, such as FATE and Cortex, just doesn't grab me. For my "simulationist" style of play, BASH is as good as it gets. It has an exponential scale of results which is more representative of super abilities and powers. It has modular flexibility to combine powers in endless ways to create whatever kind of hero/villain you want. It has plenty of tactical options to keep combat interesting and portray comic book stylized action. Great mook rules. And on and on... I've not found a more * system for this genre.

So although I'm disappointed in the direction of this new Marvel game, I am thankful that we have a little game like BASH that can kick the crap out the big names!

Just think if BASH got rights to a big IP someday! Wow...

I may a bit off the mark in my impression of the new Marvel game, if so let me know.

Am I missing out on these story games?

Do you guys think the new Marvel game will be successful in the long run or another flash in the pan?

[BeardedDork]

Cortex seems pretty gimmicky. I have a hard time imagining this becoming anybody's favorite game. It just isn't accessible enough, that's the same problem I had with the Marvel Saga System, which I loved but it was hard to just sit down with some buddies to pick up and play a game. My belief is that specialized equipment being required kind of dooms a game even if it is awesome.

[MrJupiter]

I don't always read comics, but when I do, I prefer Marvel.

… although I'm disappointed in the direction of this new Marvel game, I am thankful that we have a little game like BASH that can kick the crap out the big names!

Just think if BASH got rights to a big IP someday! Wow...

We do! If only we could convince AslanC and his team to give us more of the Zenith Comics Universe! Okay, Zenith isn’t really a big IP like Marvel, DC, and Image, but I really enjoyed reading the stories and backgrounds of his heroes and villains in the two supplements they put out and all the posts in the forums here. Also, I did read somewhere that AslanC was writing a comic book, so who knows? Some day…

[Samuraidad]

Agreed,the new Marvel rpg doesn't seem nearly as accessible as BASH. I'm going to stick with BASH UE myself. That being said, I may pick up one or two of the setting books for this new Marvel game as possible source material. I think I heard Cam Banks mention that they are going to do an Astonishing X-Men setting book which I loved (the Joss Whedon tpbs not the Marvel rpg book obviously) which would be cool to read. And I definitely heard him say there will be an Age of Apolcalypse book which might be interesting. Depends on how much they are really. I'm not going to plunk down big $$ for reading material.

And I 2nd the motion with Mr. Jupiter! More Zenith stuff for BASH would be awesome'ness! I'm still wanting to see A.S.G.A.R.D. fleshed out and statted up!

[Nestor]

This isn't really the place to get into discussion about other games, but I will say the Cortex+ system does have some benefits. Whether they will work with a setting like Marvel is really too early to tell.

Honestly, their dice resolution system isn't really that more esoteric than rolling two dice and multiplying it by your attribute.

[Paladin]

Just think if BASH got rights to a big IP someday! Wow...

Well...

Not so much a Marvel/DC thing, but I suspect BASH! will get something of a shot in the arm once we get the OmniVerse off the ground next year.

And if you don't know what I am talking about, follow me on Google+ and asked to be added to the OmniVerse Circle. There's some interesting revelations there.

I am very much looking forward to working with Chris to both enhance the super-heroic end of what we are doing and give BASH! a solid market push.

[kroh]

BASH! does a great job of letting you just pick up and go with a supers game with a mechanic that can be learned and played with quickly.
Games like FATE AND ICONS are fun in that they offer a break from the crunch of the majority of games out there today. The thing about BASH that takes it to that extra special tier of play is that it was designed for the fast pace of supers. Games that grind things to a halt don't work well for supers. games that are too touchy freely don't work well with supers in my opinion. supers is about action and intrigue. I don't want soap opera in my supers.

In any case, lets keep making bash rise to the top
And if some one has a product they want to push let me know.

[AslanC]

I agree with everything said here in the thread

My thanks for the compliments on the Zenith Universe, and if you go here;

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Zenith-Co ... 0617455674

you can keep up with our developing comic book, which will be a free web comic called HEROIC.

As it stands, Walt's Hazard Studio is the official licensee of the Zenith Universe and as far as I know we will always back BASH first and other systems after that

Cheers!

[Samuraidad]

Just think if BASH got rights to a big IP someday! Wow...

Well...

Not so much a Marvel/DC thing, but I suspect BASH! will get something of a shot in the arm once we get the OmniVerse off the ground next year.

And if you don't know what I am talking about, follow me on Google+ and asked to be added to the OmniVerse Circle. There's some interesting revelations there.

I am very much looking forward to working with Chris to both enhance the super-heroic end of what we are doing and give BASH! a solid market push.

That's awesome Paladin! I can't wait to see that unfold!

[Jukeboxer]

Thanks all for the replies! Good points. I was just feeling a touch of frustration that Marvel & MWP went this route. I was hoping to at least use the new stuff for conversion to BASH, but I don't think it would be very useful in that regard either. Now if you want to run a Marvel campaign based on a particular event, then it may still be worth a look.

@paladin: your Omniverse project is a grand idea! I heard mention of it on a podcast a few months ago, but you were using Icons at the time. It will be interesting to see how this unfolds.

I think I get what Samaraidad is saying about "accessible". Since Cortex uses an array of die-types to represent a variety aspects, some of which are not so tangible, it doesn't seem as friendly to a new gamer. Whereas BASH takes a more concrete approach and accomplishes the bulk of the action with 2d6 x Stat.

[capmarvel]

I just looked at a copy of Cortex...reminded me a lot of Savage Worlds.

Needless to say, I like the math in BASH better. Personally, when there are too many attributes or stats or math it gets in the way of "just playing a fun game".




PS- any idea what a Marvel or DC license costs? Curious what a publisher needs to spend to get one.

[Jukeboxer]

yeah, the original Cortex was very comparable with Savage Worlds, but Cortex Plus has a much more aspect-driven philosophy.

The last I heard, a big license was in the 10s of thousands range, but that may have changed. For instance, it seems that DC and Marvel are more hands-on these days about approving licensed material before it is shipped.

[kroh]

So what are we getting for BASH!

[Baelor]

Steve Jackson managed to get Hellboy for a splatbook several years back. Perhaps the lesser publishers [and I don't mean less quality, just less volume] are in the ballpark of BASH publishers. I really don't know.

[arthurfallz]

The Cortex system is one I played back when the Serenity / Firefly RPG first came out. It was an all-right system, but it had it's limits. The newer iterations look like they fixed up some of the problems, but it's going to be it's own beast in terms of "hero stats" and the like.

Converting those heroes over to other systems is going to be useless for the most part. I think going to http://marvel.wikia.com/Main_Page is still going to be a lot more useful for statting up heroes in BASH than the newest Marvel RPG will be. For that matter, the old FASERIP TSR one isn't great for it either - how stats were done entirely depended on the era of that game (pre-Ulimate Powers, Ultimate Powers, post-Ultimate Powers entries). Most RPGs do not stat heroes awfully well a lot of the time, and the use of modern devices like Wikis make grabbing those RPGs useless.