Trick Shot or Power Stunt?

[AngryGhost]

I've got to thinking that sometimes there might be a gray area between Trick Shots and Power Stunts.

If I had a character that could change Mass (one shot help thread has her in full) who could fly up high, change to a dense mass and then plummet to the ground in order to hit the surface with the relevant speed and tons behind it to create a shockwave/area effect etc would it:

a) be a power stunt as it's like a special attack?
b) be a trick shot/called or not?
c) be treated like p41 super movement and momentum (or something similar?)

[BeardedDork]

I would say a & c.

[AngryGhost]

I would say a & c.

I was afraid that might be the case.

I was hoping it wouldn't be as I want to try to get my players to come up with weird and wonderful uses of their powers, and as there's only so many times you can do power stunts they might end up with "do special attack, repeat".

[kevperrine]

I would say a & c.

I was afraid that might be the case.

I was hoping it wouldn't be as I want to try to get my players to come up with weird and wonderful uses of their powers, and as there's only so many times you can do power stunts they might end up with "do special attack, repeat".

I agree that a+c sounds like the correct call.
However... I'm not seeing why this is an issue.

One of the things I tend to do is if a player comes up with something NEAT like this... they clearly would need to spend a Hero Die to get it done.
However, as Narrator I would say/ask:

NARRATOR TO PLAYER: "AWESOME move! The way that works by the rules is - you effectively using momentum (and the momentum rules) then enacting your Density Increase power for a Power Stunt.
That's something that if you want to make it one of those signature moves for your character you COULD buy it later with experience points."

But for now, anytime you want to do it... you'd need to spend one Hero Die for stunt that 'increase' in power as *Super Movement based off of your Density Increase power."

SIDEBAR: Technically (I believe) the use of the Momentum rules are based off of any "Super Movement and Momentum" rules (p.41). In practicality it does the same thing (Special Attack or Super Movement), who cares - it's a power stunt with a Hero Die. But if you go technically (which is a good "test" of the rules IMO) it would work exclusively with Super Movement that you would need to stunt. However, the BASH! rules are flexible enough to use the 'spirit' of the rule for a good Narrator to swap out "Super Movement" replaced with a Special Attack. Just make the call on how many extra +Damage Modifier the Density Increase power would give (from +1 to +4) I'd rule it a + for each rank in the power up to +4 (since that's the cap of the core momentum rules).

NARRATOR TO PLAYER: "What do you think? Worth it? Want to spend that Hero Die? Is that something you'd consider a signature move? I ask because I don't want our campaign to come down to 'gaming the rules' to do an action just to get the extra bonus all the time... But if you think it's something cool for your character - spend the Hero Die and describe it!!."

Assuming the player agrees... after a great fun description and accounting for the rules of what happened.

NARRATOR DESCRIPTION: "*CUT SCENE* somewhere below as commuters busstle past one another getting onto and off of the sub-way metro... dust from the rafters rains down, covering an annoyed businesswoman's new dress... and the local news reports calls from citizens of an earthquake. Something your hero might chuckle about when he hears the news tonight, about the localized 3.5 rictor scale quake you caused!!"


NARRATOR TO PLAYER: "... Excellent move! Here's that Hero Die back!! If you do your signature move in the future, at last resorts... You may or may not be awarded Hero Points... it really depends on how COOL it is at the time!!"


As the Narrator I'm thinking that if he uses it again, he'll get 4 Hero Points... then one less each time in the future. After 4-5 uses he knows it's COOL but that to earn that Hero Die back... he'll have to come up with NEW cool creative things!

The reason for giving BACK that Hero Die (as a happy surprise after he agrees to spend it) is to encourage he and other players to do and describe cool things. THAT will get your Hero Point/Die rewards for the cool things you want to do and help "fuel" those uses of spending points/dice in battle more. Other Hero Points/Dice come from things like unselfish play in helping people, taking yourself out of action, other cool descriptions, excellent role-play, etc...


Make sense?
And lastly. I think you might consider reading/using the "Body Slam" maneuver (p.22) as an option to this. But I'd say the above is the better solution.

hope that helps!
-kev-

[BASHMAN]

I would say a & c.

I was afraid that might be the case.

I was hoping it wouldn't be as I want to try to get my players to come up with weird and wonderful uses of their powers, and as there's only so many times you can do power stunts they might end up with "do special attack, repeat".

Have you read BAM! #5? In there, I bring up the subject of "Power Tricks" as opposed to "power stunts". A trick costs 1 hero point and is a 1 time use; whereas a stunt costs a die and is for using an entire scene.

Now, as written, I have Power Tricks only for X-Mastery; and I will be incorperating them for people with the Gadgeteeer and Grimoire advantages. However, there's no reason why you cannot house rule them in for other powers.

[AngryGhost]

I would say a & c.

I was afraid that might be the case.

I was hoping it wouldn't be as I want to try to get my players to come up with weird and wonderful uses of their powers, and as there's only so many times you can do power stunts they might end up with "do special attack, repeat".

Have you read BAM! #5? In there, I bring up the subject of "Power Tricks" as opposed to "power stunts". A trick costs 1 hero point and is a 1 time use; whereas a stunt costs a die and is for using an entire scene.

Now, as written, I have Power Tricks only for X-Mastery; and I will be incorperating them for people with the Gadgeteeer and Grimoire advantages. However, there's no reason why you cannot house rule them in for other powers.

Thanks for the replies guys, I think I'm going to take what's said and play it buy ear (if I ever get my oneshot up an running) depending on how inventive the players are in the session.

Due to the nature of the pregens I'm giving them I might go either way really, either with what Kev said or what BASHMAN! said about the powertricks in BAM 5 (as the characters aren't necessarily as combat efficient as most starting superheroes, without resorting to inventive uses of their powers).

Cheers.