Question for 2 different PC ideas

[kevperrine]

Okay. I'm toying with a couple different ideas to build. I'd love any ideas on how to approach or build these ideas with BASH! UE.


#1. a completely normal person with the ability to tap into the "collective conscious" of every (currently living) person in the world. He doesn't have any special knowledge or mental ability with the tapping into, he doesn't even know he's doing it. What this allows him to DO is "borrow" any single person's ability. The trick is he must KNOW the general info on the person (like name and/or picture, etc..). What he can then DO is have the ability to use their ability. So this means he could potentially have the BEST human potential in any single area. Physical or Mental. So... He could: be the world's best:
brain surgeon, or escape artist, or strongest man, or bank robber, or marksman, or tactician, or accountant, or fastest man, or best basketball player, computer hacker, etc... etc...
But with the limitation of only one at a time, switching between panels (as normally activating a power). Again the TRICK is he has to know of the person. So he might either carry around a new copy of the "Guinesse Book of World Records" or a smart phone (for googling "world's fastest man") or having done research and having his own little index cards on people. (this might be a limitation to have to roll a skill to "know" of a person in that field if he doesn't have a named person yet).
Lastly... How would this be done with Stats and Powers and Skills and Advantages? And WHAT would be considered "human maximums"? And would you build out some various power "blocks" (like a Shapeshifter PC might) to have it ready to go in-game?


#2. how would you make a PC hero (doesn't matter his power set) that has the Immunity to sleep - the trick is he doesn't know he's immune to sleep because when he lays down to sleep he ACTUALLY runs off to BE a super villain (perhaps with totally different power set or even the SAME powers)... but the better bit is, the "villain" side KNOWS he's only active when the "hero" is asleep. So he acts and is villainous in a way that he WON'T tip off the hero (or else the hero may start locking himself up at night!)... I would assume this is some sort of Disadvantage or something. But how would you do it? And how would you handle the Villain build? Would this be an Alter Ego or Involuntary change of some sort?



any ideas
-kev-

[BASHMAN]

1. Sounds like a variation of Skill Mimic which is an Alternate Power to Copycat.

2. Alter Ego, but "Inconvenient" meaning that it doesn't cost him an Advantage.

[kevperrine]

1. Sounds like a variation of Skill Mimic which is an Alternate Power to Copycat.

2. Alter Ego, but "Inconvenient" meaning that it doesn't cost him an Advantage.

Duh. completely missed Alter Ego as inconvenient. Question. Do you think it would ALSO have Involuntary Change disad? Or do you think just the Alter Ego as a disad would be more than enough?


On the Skill Mimic - that's a great plan, I could also see giving it the limitation for only one at a time.
Now... the bigger question on this character that would have NOT ONLY the skills but also any abilities (powers) or Advantages that another normal (but gifted) person in the world would have.
I think Copycat works well, but I'm a little stuck on how many levels would work well to mimic the "best human" skills. I suppose what would be necessary is to go through the powers and figure out WHICH ones could be simulated by a normal person at maximum human potential.

For example:
- possibly each stat maxed out (Boost) to HUMAN potential, then the addition of Heightened to specialize to max human potential. To get "the strongest human" or "fastest human" or "strongest willed" human.
- probably all the levels needed to gain any Intense Training powers
- maybe even Swinging (for humans in the circus) and Gliding (for the humans that skydive) though I'd need the equipment to do it.

With the Limitation: Situational (knows of another human that can do the skill/power/advantage).

It seems like 4 levels in Copy Cat would do it. And only 1 point in Skill Mimic (both with the Enhancement & Limitation: That the mimicked skill/power/advantage would last until "replaced" with another.

So check me on this build:
(do all these Enhancements and Limitations and general power builds seem right?)


=============================

Character's Name: "ANYBODY" (aka. Integer)

BRAWN 1
AGILITY 1
MIND 2

"MANKIND'S BEST"
[TOTAL COST: 14]
(Multi-Power: Copy Cat & Skill Mimic [1]; Linked: Fleet of Foot & Swift Strike with Copy Cat or Skill Mimic [4])
COPY CAT 4 [8], Extra Effect: Can copy the following Advantages (Appeal, Dumb Luck, Frightening Presence, Jack of All Trades, Leadership, Never Surrender, Photographic Memory, Quick Thinking) [1]; Extra Effect: Range as Teleportation [1]; Limitation: must be an effect a normal human can achieve [-1]; Situational/Extended Duration: Lasts until replaced [0].
SKILL MIMIC 1 [1] Situational/Extended Duration: Lasts until replaced [0].
"BEST IN THE AREA": FLEET OF FOOT [1]
SWIFT STRIKE [2]

"FLAK JACKET"
ARMOR 2 [TOTAL COST: 2]

"STUFF SHOVED IN POCKETS"
CONJURING 2 [Limitations: Ammo, Easily Taken, Gadget, only simple items, all items must be things a normal person could acquire] [TOTAL COST: 1]

SKILLS
Steath/Shadowing; Investigation/Finding Clues, Streetwise/Gut

ADS/DISADS
Versatile / Destitute
Contacts / Normal
Never Surrender / Unskilled


STATS 8 + POWERS 17 = TOTAL 25

[BASHMAN]

Right. And if you want to copy stats, the best way to do that is with Boost, with a limit that the the stat is boosted to the level of a certain individual. You could buy it 3 times, once for each stat. The question is do you want to be able to copy 1 stat at a time, or all 3 if possible?

1 at a time, it's a multipower, otherwise, it's 3 seperate powers.

[kevperrine]

Right. And if you want to copy stats, the best way to do that is with Boost, with a limit that the the stat is boosted to the level of a certain individual. You could buy it 3 times, once for each stat. The question is do you want to be able to copy 1 stat at a time, or all 3 if possible?

1 at a time, it's a multipower, otherwise, it's 3 seperate powers.

HEY!
Good call. I hadn't thought of that. I was thinking that this character would simply "Copy Cat" Boost as needed. But IF the "best" skill/thing he wanted to copy from one person HAPPENED to "need" to increase say: 2 of his stats AND give him a power, then it would NEED to be seperate instead of just relying on "Copy Cat" to copy Boost.

Hmmm, need to consider the concept more and look into that.

any other thoughts folks?
-kev-

[BASHMAN]

You can't Copycat Boost unless the target HAS Boost.

[kevperrine]

You can't Copycat Boost unless the target HAS Boost.

I hadn't thought of that.
I suppose I was just thinking of a WAY to "mimic" the other person's Stat ranks. But your thought of giving just a base ability to BOOST, with the limitation that it must have a person to mimic from is actually what I should do. In fact, it's probably a multi-power of the Copy Cat ability maybe? With the idea that it has to function/activate to mimic the person the Copy Cat is getting the skill/advantage or power from?


TWO questions on from a "cool by the rules" standpoint.

Do you think taking an "Enhancement: Extra Effect" meet the ability to "copy" Advantages?

Also "Enhancement: Extra Effect" to have the range function like Teleportation's range factors? The idea is he can tap into the WORLD'S collective consciousness and "copy/mimic" an ability of "anyone" (currently alive) across the planet. So for example: if the best brain surgeon on the planet it in Nepal, and he's in NYC he can STILL "Skill Mimic" him.

Or is that too powerful. Or worth MORE than just 1 pt. Or would it all be best covered with another power set?



Still really learn the nuances of the system
thanks again!
-kev-


PS...
I went to Green Ronin's 10 year anniversary. Played a short-shot of M&M3e/DCA with Steve Kenson running it. I played Robin in the short scenerio. While I liked Steve's GMing. The system STILL fell flat for me now that I've seen BASH! in action. Weird, when just less than a year ago it was my favorite supers system. hehe
KUDOS to BASH!

[BASHMAN]

Well, Most advantages are things that can't be copied, like having a mentor or security clearance. However, I guess for some (like Instant Change) copying would make sense. I would allow that as a Narrator with Extra Effect.

You don't need the "extra effect" enhancement on Skill Mimic. You would need 4pts of Range + the Space enhancement (assuming Narrator allows it) to affect anyone on Earth.

[kevperrine]

Well, Most advantages are things that can't be copied, like having a mentor or security clearance. However, I guess for some (like Instant Change) copying would make sense. I would allow that as a Narrator with Extra Effect.

You don't need the "extra effect" enhancement on Skill Mimic. You would need 4pts of Range + the Space enhancement (assuming Narrator allows it) to affect anyone on Earth.

Oh! Space Enhancement? I'll have to look for that! Thanks for the heads up.

and Yes. for the Advantages, I actually made a list of the ones that COULD be mimiced:
Extra Effect: Can copy the following Advantages:
Appeal, Dumb Luck, Frightening Presence, Jack of All Trades, Leadership, Never Surrender, Photographic Memory, Quick Thinking [1]


Those all seem like abilities that a normal person would have that a mimic like this could "borrow". With Appeal and Frightening Presence being completely described as the attitude, vibe/feeling and such (not changing his actual appearance).

I didn't know if that would be worth more than a 1 character point Enhancement.

-kev-

[BASHMAN]

The only downside to letting someone mimic those abilities is it throws off balance of an Advantage costs you something (a disad). How many character points is it worth to have ANY of those advantages whenever you want it? Can he switch them up from Round to Round? That's even more powerful.

The more I think about it, the more broken this sounds. The ones that give you a Free Hero Die to do X/Once per session are defiantly broken to let someone copy. Used up your "Never Surrender?" Okay, time to switch to "Quick Thinking". Used that up, now time to take "Dumb Luck". Do you see how abused that could be.

Essentially what I think you need to do for this is create a new power. 1-5 levels. For each level, you get to pick an Advantage. You can have any one of those advantages "on" at a time.

[kevperrine]

The more I think about it, the more broken this sounds.
...
Do you see how abused that could be.

Great BASHMAN. I actually enjoy and appreciate understanding the vision of where the rule breaks. It helps me in building (and playing) later.

Your example/description makes sense that allowing that as an Enhancement is too powerful.

I will either be deleting it, or giving the character those advantages or...

Essentially what I think you need to do for this is create a new power. 1-5 levels. For each level, you get to pick an Advantage. You can have any one of those advantages "on" at a time.

I like this.
I'd like to see it expanded into an ACTUAL power. But that's only if you (and game players out there) think it's a warrented power.
The way you describe it, it sounds very cool at base.

Then I ask... Well... Character Point wise... why would THIS "power" be worth taking over just using the Optional rule for buying Advantages (in the back of the core rules) and having them on all the time?

While that *new* power fits the concept I'm shooting for... I'd like to see it written/developed to have a solid reason for being a great option over just taking Advantages (as normal) or buying them with the optional rule.


Here's a thought. It seems like this power would be more worth (being created) for a player to have 2 chosen Advantages per level. (thoughts??)
What about this:


new power

ADVANTAGEOUS
1-5 pts, Personal, Sustained
For each level in this power, choose two Advantages, you can have any one of those advantages "on" at a time. The Advantage that is chosen is sustained between scenes and between issues until you switch out.